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Москалев.Е.
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Дата
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24.04.2008 08:37:38
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Современность; Космос;
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Re: Но это...
>Приветствую
>> если конечно подтвердится эта версия. После Союз-5 таких казусов ЕМНИП небыло.
>
>Сейчас много кто чего говорит по этому поводу
>На "новости космонавтики" 40 страниц исписали
>Там это конечно быстро "обхаяли"
"обхаяли", да
Lev
СообщениеДобавлено: Ср Апр 23, 2008 19:39
СА c утра в Подлипках. Говорят - обгорел сильнее чем раньше при БС, но не критично. "На грани гибели экипажа" не быпо. Как всегда, много слухов. Sad
igel
СообщениеДобавлено: Ср Апр 23, 2008 19:19
Постарался рассмотреть повнимательнее на доступных фото следы обтекания/обгорания. Аномалии, конечно, есть, но практически все "в пределах погрешности". Основная картина вполне соответствует долгому полету на балансировочном угле. То есть, если какие-то "безобразия" и были, то в основном только в начале полета, и не долго, и последующее "нормальное" обгорание замаскировало следы. Неплохо, конечно, было бы взглянуть на фото со стороны люка и парашютов, но нету.
Обратил внимание на довольно необычную "тень" от гермоплаты. Вот вырезка из снимка, а рядом для сравнения - то же место из 12-й экспедиции (линк на полное фото http://www.spaceflight.nasa.gov/gallery/images/station/crew-12/hires/jsc2006e14024.jpg).
Такая тень в принципе может означать, что гермоплата не отделилась сразу, а отвалилась где-то потом от напора или отстрелилась по термодатчику. Что интересно, тень не вполне симметричная: в верхней части снимка пересекает обрез иллюминатора, в нижней наоборот, отходит от него. Вывод: тот, кто сидел в правом кресле, страдает от избыточного веса Smile. Другая версия, более вероятная - сдув потока из-за закрутки СА на БС. Да и тень на самом деле может и вовсе ничего не означать: на сравнительном снимке некоторый намек на тень тоже имеется, может быть просто следствие отрыва потока на "шероховатой" плате.
А что это за белая "блямба" ниже платы и иллюминатора? Что там так выразително торчало в поток, и куда потом делось? Сравнительный снимок не очень хрошо сфокусирован, но такого обтекания там (вроде бы) нет...
Вообще, как я припоминаю (из "неофициальных", правда, источников), у Волынова в свое время не отделился не сам отсек, а кабель-мачта. болталась, пока не оторвалась(перегорела?). Представить неотделение всего отсека, по шпангоуту, мне как-то трудно... То есть, представить-то вполне, а вот со счастливым исходом - трудно. В картине, которую нарисовал японец, СА очень хорошо "защищает" ПО, люк столько не продержится, чтобы тот сам собой отвалился... Вот если он только на кабель-мачте болтается - другое дело... Почему я к этой тени на боку и приглядываюсь так придирчиво Smile
А вообще - спасибо "Союзу". "Правопорядок в стране определяется не наличием воров, а умением властей их обезвреживать"
http://collectspace.com/review/iss16_landing09.jpg
Via Oberg, here is a Japanese artist's representation of Soyuz 5, offering a better depiction of the proper configuration.
Gerstenmaier revealed that Soyuz TMA-10, which landed in October 2007, not only experienced a ballistic return (which was caused by a faulty cable), but had also encountered a "separation issue" between its descent and propulsion modules. A cable running between the two sections — different from the one that triggered the ballistic mode — had continued to relay thruster data even after the explosive bolts holding the modules together had fired, indicating that the two were still connected.
A similar failed separation led to the nearly-fatal reentry of Boris Volynov aboard Soyuz 5 in January 1969. In both cases, the modules finally separated due to the aerodynamic stresses pushing against them.
"The other event on the last Soyuz was the separation event where we believe one of the pyro bolts that attached the instrumentation section, the pyro section, failed to separate properly. That kept the instrumentation section and the propulsion section attached to the spacecraft for a longer period of time than desired," he explained.
"Those interfaces are designed such that even if the pyros don't separate the bolt, eventually the heating and aerodynamic forces will cause that interface to break and separate. We believe that is what happened on the last Soyuz."
"The Russians know that from the fact that there is a cable interface that runs between the descent capsule and the instrumentation - propulsion section. Commands were able to go across that cable and actually fire thrusters on the propulsion section of the other module on the last flight, so therefore we know that the interface was not broken as it should have been at the separation command and that's how we have the data from the previous flight that that occurred."
Sources cited by Russian news reports have suggested that the failed separation of the two Soyuz sections caused the vehicle to enter the Earth's atmosphere nose- or hatch-down, leading to severe heating damage and a loss of communications with the ground.
Gerstenmaier confirmed the radio cut-off but said they did not yet know its cause. He attributed the separation reports to speculation by crew members Peggy Whitson and Yuri Malenchenko, who reported seeing and feeling "off-nominal" motion in the capsule.
"They felt some anomalous motion in the spacecraft," described Gerstenmaier, in response to a question from collectSPACE.com. "They felt some kind of bumping around — a movement forward in their seats, a movement aft in their seats, a movement to the right, a movement to the left."
"So, they felt a general kind of jostling in their seats that they had not felt before and that was prior to the initiation of the ballistic mode on the spacecraft and after the separation command. During that period of time, they experienced some off-nominal motion. They physically felt some off-nominal motion in the spacecraft."
Gerstenmaier said it might take several months before the Russians could report what had transpired. In the interim, he warned against making guesses as to the cause. "I don't want us to speculate, as I think that drives the discussion or drives the concern maybe in a direction that isn't appropriate for us at this time," he said.
"I don't see this as a major problem," he commented, "but it is clearly something that should not have occurred."
http://collectspace.com/ubb/Forum30/HTML/000691.html#scale
posted April 22, 2008 10:34 PM Peggy Whitson was interviewed just after her landing on April 19 by NASA public affairs officer Rob Navias. The audio of that discussion [2.76mb mp3] was released to reporters on Tuesday.
While replying to a question about the nature of her and her crew mates return to Earth, Whitson touched very briefly on what is now believed to have been problems during the separation of the Soyuz TMA-11's descent and propulsion modules.
Immediately, or shortly after разделение [razdyelyeniye], we switched automatically to the ballistic mode, which means we were going to be spinning up to 8 Gs and coming in an on steeper descent. And I saw 8.2 Gs on the meter. It was a pretty, pretty dramatic. Gravity is not really my friend right now and 8 Gs was especially not my friend! But it didn't last too long. You know chute deploy was nominal and impact, I guess maybe because I heard so many stories, wasn't quite as bad as I was expecting. But разделение was a little more dramatic than I was expecting. разделение is the separation of the modules.
Robert Pearlman
Editor
http://situation.ru/